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1st message | this message only posted: 21 Oct 2012 22:50
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from:
julia
 

 

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Is there a definitive tutorial on creating 3 way turnouts in the latest version of templot? 
Thanks
J
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2nd message | this message only posted: 21 Oct 2012 23:12
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from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



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julia wrote: Is there a definitive tutorial on creating 3 way turnouts in the latest version of Templot?Hi Julia,

Sorry not yet. One of the reasons Templot is currently free is that the existing docs are all out-of-date. :)

A new tutorial and video is on my to-do list. Unfortunately this stuff takes 10 times longer to do than writing the actual program. :(

However I wrote a quick run-down of the Templot2 changes for tandems here:

 http://85a.co.uk/forum/view_topic.php?id=1487&forum_id=17#p9841

and some notes about it here:

 http://85a.co.uk/forum/view_topic.php?id=1567&forum_id=1

The old video is here:

 http://www.templot.com/martweb/videos/3_way_tandem.exe

regards,

Martin.

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3rd message | this message only posted: 21 Oct 2012 23:23
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julia
 

 

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I really am struggling to do anything more than just create a single turnout with templot. Following all these instructions I don't end up with the hoped for turnout. At this stage I just want to make a simple H0e 3 way turnout, with 700mm radius on both sides...

J
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4th message | this message only posted: 21 Oct 2012 23:45
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from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



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Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

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julia wrote: I really am struggling to do anything more than just create a single turnout with templot. Following all these instructions I don't end up with the hoped for turnout. At this stage I just want to make a simple H0e 3 way turnout, with 700mm radius on both sides...Hi Julia,

That sounds like you want a symmetrical 3-throw turnout?

In which case you can get the basic alignments just by overlaying left and right hand turnouts:

1. start with a straight turnout of the required size (radius).

2. press the CTRL+0 (zero) keys.

3. press the INSERT key.

4. click the template > swap hand menu item.

5. press the INSERT key.

6. press the HOME key.

However, have you actually tried building such a thing? It's very tricky to get the coincident switches working properly -- such turnouts are confined to yards and sidings on the prototype. Far more common are 3-way tandem turnouts, with staggered switches, as in the video.

regards,

Martin.

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5th message | this message only posted: 21 Oct 2012 23:54
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julia
 

 

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I am noticing that my new laptop doesn't appear to have an insert button on they keyboard, is there an alternative key combination?

The turnout in question is for a yard, it is the turnout that feeds into a 3 road engine shed. In terms of what the final turnout looks like, I am open to the possibility that a 3 way tandem may be what I think I want. one track going straight through, one going right (radius 700mm), one going left (radius 700mm). they don't have to both diverge at the same location, they could be offset slightly, but not to much, the idea is that is should take up less space than 2 normal turnouts. I think in my mind I am seeing something like the peco "asymmetric 3 way" only with the radii of both being the same?

Does that make sense?

J
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6th message | this message only posted: 22 Oct 2012 01:08
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from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



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Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
julia wrote: I am noticing that my new laptop doesn't appear to have an insert button on they keyboard, is there an alternative key combination?Hi Julia,

On laptops the INSERT key is usually somewhere near the top right corner. I'd be surprised if there isn't one. However the alternatives are to click the top tool-button having a double down-arrow, or the main > store & background menu item, or press CTRL+V.

one track going straight through, one going right (radius 700mm), one going left (radius 700mm). they don't have to both diverge at the same location, they could be offset slightly Do they have to be the same radius? Generally for a tandem that makes things tricky, as it's difficult to stagger the switches far enough to be able to open the second switch, without getting the middle crossing too close to the next crossing. It may be possible with some careful watching of the clearances, something like this perhaps:



As you can see, the lower check rail on the middle crossing is going to be difficult.

A tandem is much easier if the two turnouts can differ. Why is it so important that they are both the same radius?

regards,

Martin.

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7th message | this message only posted: 22 Oct 2012 17:52
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julia
 

 

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For clarity it is not critical that they are the same radius. the one diverging to the right has to be 700mm, but the one to the left can diverge by more than 700mm.

J
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8th message | this message only posted: 30 Oct 2012 10:33
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from:
Ray Hughes
Milton Keynes, United Kingdom

 

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Martin Wynne wrote: ...
As you can see, the lower check rail on the middle crossing is going to be difficult.

...


I've overlaid an A5 and an A5.5, both semi-curved. The check rails weren't a problem but the running surface of the straight switch blade of the turnout nearest the crossing vees fouls the non running surface of the curved switch blade of the other turnout albeit only when both are set for their respective divergent routes.

I can move the "points" further apart but that would then appear to compromise the crossing vee/check rail of the crossing closest to the tie-bars.

Is there any kind of formula/process for hitting the ideal relative positions? I can overcome the problem by interlocking the two sets of switches so that they can't both we set for the divergent route (of which only the first encountered set of switches is actually routeing).

I have yet to try the 9ft straight heel switch option. Is this likely to make a difference?

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9th message | this message only posted: 30 Oct 2012 11:03
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from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



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Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
Ray Hughes wrote:Is there any kind of formula/process for hitting the ideal relative positions?Hi Ray,

Generally, you should either build a proper 3-throw turnout (with the switches coincident), or a tandem turnout (with the second switch staggered completely beyond the heel of the first one). If you have a situation where the switches are staggered but still need to be interlocked, it seems that you have created a non-prototypical hybrid arrangement.

The usual rules for a tandem are that the first switch should have a heel offset of at least 10" at the toe of the second switch, and the fine-point (FP) of the middle crossing must be at least 14" from the nearest running rail. Otherwise it's not possible to fit all the chairs with the required clearances. Generally this means you need a significant difference in the crossing angles. For example a common size is a 1:6 turnout combined with a 1:8 turnout. A difference of only 1:5 to 1:5.5 may not be enough, but some further lead length adjustment is possible on the flatter angles by increasing the crossing entry straight.

I have yet to try the 9ft straight heel switch option. Is this likely to make a difference?Yes, it will significantly change the geometry. Generally using the shorter straight switches saves a lot of space on non-natural turnouts and gives you more flexibility in the design of formations. You don't have to actually build them as loose-heel switches if you don't want to -- just adopt the geometry, adding dummy heel joints.

I'm currently trying to get the next program update finished. But a top priority after that will be to make a completely new tutorial and video on tandem turnouts. This topic comes up very often, and Templot2 contains changes which make it a bit easier than the old video.

regards,

Martin.

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10th message | this message only posted: 8 Nov 2012 20:18
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from:
julia
 

 

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 Looking at the image above, and a lot of the turnout templates I can find for 3 way turnouts, where they are made up of non matching turnouts, I.e. a #6 and a #8, the shorter one is always off to the left, is there a reason for this?

I'm slightly confused by the terminology being used, 3 way turnout, tandem, asymmetric 3 way etc...
Looking at the track plan I want to build, I think what is needed is a 3 way where the right hand turning point is first, and then the left. Both need to be a minimum of 700mm radius, but they don't need to both be the same. With this in mind, what is the turnout I am wanting to build? Is this technically a tandem?

Thanks

J
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