click here for a list of all existing Templot documentation
  Important Privacy Information cookie information pre-print options:    

 click image to open Templot Club in a new tab             Search           remove page highlighting
Templot club top logo
  looking for help ? -- -- --
looking for Templot? - (free)


enjoy using Templot? - 

 you are not logged in  - Login | Join

receive all messages by email: info


Recent Topics
Front Page  Search  Image Gallery  Gallery Upload  My Account  Members  SourceForge  TemplotMEC  Help  
make a donation  
please click: important information for new members and first-time visitors Templot Companion - User Guide
            messages archive on Yahoo
page trail:  Templot Club > Forums > Off track > FAO Martin. Request to be added to the list of those who can see the development page
Templot web site

                 FAO Martin. Request to be added to the list of those who can see the development page
     
 Start new topic   Reply blank   Printer friendly 
  Rate this topic  
AuthorMessage
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
1st message | this message only posted: 8 Feb 2020 15:31
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
DerekStuart
United Kingdom

 

view images in gallery
view images as slides
Hello Martin
Sorry, I can't find the thread you discussed this, but could you add me to the list of those who can view the development sub-forum, please?

I am particularly looking for the thread where you described how to get started with programming (the link to the compiler and there were a couple of useful sites you suggested for further guidance.)

I'm afraid I'm not about to develop Templot 3 any time soon, but I'm hoping to get beyond "Hello World."

Many thanks
Derek

__________
message ref: 28978

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
2nd message | this message only posted: 8 Feb 2020 15:48
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
DerekStuart
United Kingdom

 

view images in gallery
view images as slides
Thanks Martin. I can see it now.

A nice weekend of reading awaits (not to mention some headaches no doubt).

Derek
__________
message ref: 28979

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
3rd message | this message only posted: 8 Feb 2020 15:50
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



view images in gallery
view images as slides

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
Hi Derek,

You are now green. :)

You should now be able to see:

 http://85a.co.uk/forum/view_forum.php?id=26

although there hasn't been much activity recently. See also:

 http://85a.co.uk/forum/view_topic.php?id=3539&forum_id=1

The original "starting with Lazarus" topic is at:

 http://85a.co.uk/forum/view_topic.php?id=3283&forum_id=26

although I think it might need some updating. The latest set of files is at (click the Files tab):

 https://sourceforge.net/projects/opentemplot/

including the MECBOX option to import files from Templot2.

Ask again if you can't find anything -- things had got into a bit of a muddle. There is an option to try T3 directly within the latest Templot2 program update --T3 > run Templot3 menu item.

cheers,

Martin.

__________
message ref: 28980

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
4th message | this message only posted: 8 Feb 2020 16:04
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
DerekStuart
United Kingdom

 

view images in gallery
view images as slides
Many thanks Martin. I really appreciate it.

I really don't want to bother you with questions, but if I could ask one in order to point me in the right direction.

If you were starting programming Templot from scratch now, would you still use a Pascal-based language? The internet is full of people with very definite opinions either way.

Thanks
Derek
__________
message ref: 28981

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
5th message | this message only posted: 8 Feb 2020 16:21
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



view images in gallery
view images as slides

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
DerekStuart wrote: If you were starting programming Templot from scratch now, would you still use a Pascal-based language? The internet is full of people with very definite opinions either way.Hi Derek,

Yes, I think I would still choose Pascal.

20+ years ago before starting to port Templot to the Windows OS I did try a couple of other languages (Visual Basic and C), and didn't feel comfortable with either of them. After all this time wedded to Pascal I doubt I would find them any more appealing now.

I do like a strongly-typed language. Working in Javascript drives me nuts when I can never be quite sure whether I'm dealing with an integer, a float, a string, an array, or whatever. Leading to lots of quoting errors.

But I don't think you should take too much notice of what I think -- I'm a bit set in my ways these days. :)

However, Templot3 is staying in Lazarus -- unless or until someone other than me tries porting it elsewhere.

cheers,

Martin.

__________
message ref: 28982

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
6th message | this message only posted: 14 Feb 2020 09:54
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



view images in gallery
view images as slides

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
Hi Derek,

Embarcadero have just launched a new site for learning Delphi and Pascal:

 https://www.learndelphi.org/

No doubt they will be pushing Delphi rather than Lazarus, but the basics are the same and the content there is released under Creative Commons. Worth watching.

cheers,

Martin.

__________
message ref: 29023

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
7th message | this message only posted: 16 Feb 2020 12:49
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
DerekStuart
United Kingdom

 

view images in gallery
view images as slides
Hello Martin

Thanks for both posts. Opinion on languages is, as usual, divisive, but it seems that Pascal and its derivatives are generally well respected. As it's something where I can easily look at existing code, it seems logical to stick with it.

I've just opened learndelphi.org and immediately found a good looking beginners guide in PDF- exactly what I was looking for (I've also ordered a couple of books from Waterstones too).

Progress is slow, I'm afraid, but when I get something to work it gives a sense of achievement that I must admit is a little addictive.

Thanks
Derek
__________
message ref: 29037

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
8th message | this message only posted: 16 Feb 2020 15:01
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



view images in gallery
view images as slides

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
DerekStuart wrote:Progress is slow, I'm afraid, but when I get something to work it gives a sense of achievement that I must admit is a little addictive.Hi Derek,

I agree. It can be very slow at the start because there is almost too much to take in, and you have nothing but a blank screen in front of you. I had the great advantage of having the existing Templot program to convert to Delphi, and I could therefore ignore all the stuff I didn't need.

Bear in mind that Delphi is primarily intended for corporate and business applications which display a lot of text and text entry boxes, and reference the data in a complex database structure. None of that was relevant to Templot, so I could cheerfully ignore at least 50% of the developer docs -- and I still wouldn't know where to start in developing a Delphi database or a business-style application. :)

My advice would be to start with a simple but interesting core application onto which you can bolt and unbolt extra features as you dream them up. That way you can learn what works and what doesn't as you go along, without losing the core part as a working fallback.

For example, you might start with a program which lays a row of bricks across the screen. Then another row on top of it. Then stagger them in a proper brick-bond pattern, needing some half-bricks at the end of the rows. Then spaces for some mortar between the bricks and rows. Then a whole wall. Then put in a doorway. Then a window. Make it a shop window. Put a can of baked beans in the shop window. Then a pile of cans. Then some boxes of cornflakes. Ask the user how many of each they require, and remove them from the pile. Put a canopy over the window to keep the rain off. Make it an arched doorway. Put a nameboard over the shop. Ask the user for its name and phone number. Make a whole row of shops. Print a list of their postcodes. Make one of them a post office...

In the end you might have something actually usable on your layout... :)

cheers,

Martin.

__________
message ref: 29040

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
9th message | this message only posted: 16 Feb 2020 23:19
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
DerekStuart
United Kingdom

 

view images in gallery
view images as slides
Thanks Martin

I've learned a fair bit of lower level languages- VBA, Commodore basic, even html, by reverse engineering. A crude way of just deleting random lines to see what stops working.

But all the available sample code is either terribly simple or terribly complex... or just terrible.

I guess you mean the bricks being drawn dynamically as opposed to detailing the size and 0,0 point of each one. Ie "draw a brick x pixels wide, draw second brick at x+1 pixel and then draw..." I think I could work out how to do that, but not how to control when it comes to the end of the window.

I shall experiment and let you know when I've achieved it- or failed, as the case may be.

Derek
__________
message ref: 29043

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
10th message | this message only posted: 17 Feb 2020 00:03
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



view images in gallery
view images as slides

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
DerekStuart wrote:I guess you mean the bricks being drawn dynamically as opposed to detailing the size and 0,0 point of each one. Ie "draw a brick x pixels wide, draw second brick at x+1 pixel and then draw..." I think I could work out how to do that, but not how to control when it comes to the end of the window.

I shall experiment and let you know when I've achieved it- or failed, as the case may be.
Hi Derek,

I didn't necessarily mean that you should do any of that. :) It was just the first thing that came into my head to illustrate the Meccano method that I use -- bolt something on, see if it works, if not scrub it out and bolt something else on instead...

There are various ways of doing it. For example a brick wall is quite similar to the staggered printer page outlines in Templot, so you could have a look at how those are drawn on the screen.

Or the OOP approach would be perhaps to have a class called row_of_bricks, give it properties such as the number of bricks and the size of each, and a method to draw itself at a given location on the screen. That could mean drawing the brick outlines, or you could find a nice photo of a brick, and create a row of TImage components on the screen. Or use TShapes rectangles in varying shades of brick red. With a mortar-coloured border.

You could make each brick clickable so that when clicked it becomes transparent, to gradually reveal a photograph behind. That might make a children's game to see how few bricks they can remove in order to discover what's behind the wall. Or make each brick play a tune... :)

cheers,

Martin. 

__________
message ref: 29044

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
11th message | this message only posted: 17 Feb 2020 17:15
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
DerekStuart
United Kingdom

 

view images in gallery
view images as slides
As ever, your comments are appreciated. I think the brick wall exercise is a good one, especially for what I'd like to eventually learn to do.

I've just found a couple of lines of code you've written:


"
// Windows.SetParent(data_child_form.Handle,pad_form.Handle);

// 292...

if data_child_form.Parentnil
then data_child_form.Parent.RemoveControl(data_child_form);

pad_form.InsertControl(data_child_form);
"

The whole structure seems remarkably similar to VBA. I am not an expert in VBA by any means, but I can make MS Access do whatever I want with it. I was experimenting with using VBA to control MS SQL server- though with limited success.

Oddly, using VBA I think I could probably achieve both of your examples.

Thanks
Derek
__________
message ref: 29046

 
 Clicked a link? Wrong message? Wait until the page has finished loading, click in the address bar and then press the Enter key. This is a timing bug in some browsers.
12th message | this message only posted: 17 Feb 2020 18:11
 PM  Reply with quote  Reply blank 
from:
Martin Wynne
West Of The Severn, United Kingdom



view images in gallery
view images as slides

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email or PM.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add helpful replies.
DerekStuart wrote:Oddly, using VBA I think I could probably achieve both of your examples.Hi Derek,

I confess that I had to Google VBA to find out what it is. :(

It seems to be a variant of VisualBasic6, which is no longer supported by Microsoft since the introduction of .NET around 2006. It seems odd that Microsoft are keeping it alive as VBA within its Office products but not separately as VB6.

If you like using VBA then obviously you should use it for what you want to do. Bear in mind that as far as I can see it doesn't produce executables which you could share with others, nor is there an open-source compiler such as Lazarus which can edit it, although there is some support in OpenOffice:

 https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/VBA_interoperability_in_OpenOffice

Also as an essentially interpreted language rather than compiled it is likely to be slower than compiled executables. But probably not enough to notice for simple applications.

I did do some early bits of Templot in VisualBasic5 before switching to Delphi. If I can find the code in my old backup drives I will post it here so that you can see if it will compile and run in VBA.

cheers,

Martin.

__________
message ref: 29047

 
This is topic ID = 3607     Page created at 08:18 (local time)  
You can type a quick reply to this topic here.

Click in the box to begin.


But to reply to an individual message, or to include images, attachments and formatted text, use the reply buttons on each message above.

To start a new topic in this forum, click the Start new topic button below.
To start a new topic in a different forum, click the Forum Jump drop-down list below.

             Start new topic 

 click to jump to a different forum:     Back to top of page

Templot Club > Forums > Off track > FAO Martin. Request to be added to the list of those who can see the development page
about Templot Club

list recently active topics Templot Companion - User Guide - A-Z Index Templot Explained for beginners Please click: important information for new members and first-time visitors.
indexing link for search engines

back to top of page


Please read this important note about copyright: Unless stated otherwise, all the files submitted to this web site are copyright and the property of the respective contributor. You are welcome to use them for your own personal non-commercial purposes, and in your messages on this web site. If you want to publish any of this material elsewhere or use it commercially, you must first obtain the owner's permission to do so.

The small print: All material submitted to this web site is the responsibility of the respective contributor. By submitting material to this web site you acknowledge that you accept full responsibility for the material submitted. The owner of this web site is not responsible for any content displayed here other than his own contributions. The owner of this web site may edit, modify or remove any content at any time without giving notice or reason.
Problems with this web site? Contact webmaster@templot.com.   This web site uses cookies: click for information.  
© 2020  

Powered by UltraBB - © 2009 Data 1 Systems