Templot Club Archive 2007-2020                             

topic: 3808hello
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posted: 3 Nov 2020 20:43

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Greetings,
I have been studying Templot for a while, but since I don't have much free time, progress is slow - but I have managed to print out my first ladder crossover with two B-6 turnouts across four main lines.

I am working in OO-SF, want to build the turnouts, and am using DCC concepts flexi track, and hope to install some concrete sleeper track using C&L sleepers and chairs, all in stainless steel track.

I have an aspirational plan for the loft which is 5.3m by about 2.6m, restricted by the roof supports/ trusses.  The open baseboards all constructed, with some track base for an outside loop.  The priority is to get that running, so hopefully my 4 year old daughter will spend some time with the trains while I footer about on the next stages.  

Other elements may or may not follow, such as Waverley, Glasgow Queen Street and Oban stations, with a section of the disused Callendar to Oban line at Ogle Glen between the latter two as a 'what if'.  But also sections near Caldercruix or Lenzie between Glasgow Queen Street and Waverley, and a rural section maybe near Berwick, and either a section near Montrose or near Blair Atholl.  

Short sections obviously, but have two sides to each end to include all of this.

Primarily 1970s/ 1980s, and some stock of current era for my daughters interest perhaps.

Last time I laid any track was before 1985, so I am a novice really, though soldering the tags onto the track bus was very familiar, so I reckon I was quite proficient at soldering when I was about 10 to 15 years old. 

Thanks in anticipation for your help and advice, all the best, Ian.


Attachment: attach_3170_3808_Baseboards_model_railway_loft-165904.JPG     163

posted: 4 Nov 2020 22:32

from:

DerekStuart
 
United Kingdom

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Hello Ian

That sounds an interesting plan. When younger I used to spend the school holidays in Scotland and seemingly all day between Waverley and Queen's St.

How I miss those Brush 4 push pull sets.

The only advice I can offer, in the absence of any specific questions, is to make sure you get the right gauges for 00-sf. As I understand it there are several different, but similar looking, versions about.

I hope you'll post pictures of your progress.

BTW I did have all of Waverley West end on Templot until my computer went wrong. I am re-doing it, based on the early 1970s track relaying. Previously I had it in bullhead pattern, which was wrong.

There is- or was- someone doing Queen's St. too on here.

posted: 4 Nov 2020 22:39

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Derek,
Thanks for the information and your advice. I would be very keen to see your Waverley west plan when you have that.

posted: 5 Nov 2020 07:24

from:

Andrew Barrowman
 
USA

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Hi Ian,

Welcome aboard from a former resident of your part of the World, and good luck with your project. I grew up in Paisley just beside the Canal Line and I remember the four terminus stations in Glasgow quite well although my recollections are probably slightly suspect now :)

Cheers!
Andy

posted: 5 Nov 2020 07:59

from:

Phil O
 
Plymouth - United Kingdom

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Hi Ian,

Welcome to Templot Club. It looks as if you have an interesting project ahead of you.

I have just one question before you get too far into the project, have you insulated the loft area you are using? The temperature swings in an uninsulated loft can wreak havoc with well laid track.

Cheers.

Phil.

posted: 5 Nov 2020 08:12

from:

Hayfield
 
United Kingdom

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Ian

Stainless steel rail has come in for some bad press recently, especially when trying to solder it

I assume you are talking about C&L's ST baseplates, before investing too much in too much track It will be worthwhile seeing if they are compatible. At one show we sold quite a lot of rail as one society's rail was incompatible with the Exactoscale bases they were selling

As the tool for drawing ages the rail profile enlarges, also the design may differ from the outset. whilst both may they are made to the same code, they will be different. On the other hand they may be compatible
Last edited on 5 Nov 2020 08:12 by Hayfield
posted: 6 Nov 2020 06:40

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Andy, Thanks. I read "James McVeigh - Between the Lines: A history of the railways in Glasgow" which I found fascinating. As I moved here only thirteen years ago, I was not aware of st Enoch station before, though looking at the age of the shopping centre and the surrounding developments, it makes sense. 

Ian 

posted: 6 Nov 2020 06:46

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Phil, 
Yes, but  unfortunately I can't fix that just now. The loft has no insulation, or ventilation. Summertime temperatures can get unbearably high when it is sunny. We don't get as much sun as other places, but it is s concern. We will need to do some improvements at some point as the roof ridges are old and tiles  probably needing attention.  But the expense is beyond us now.
Ian 

posted: 6 Nov 2020 06:54

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Hayfield wrote:
Ian

Stainless steel rail has come in for some bad press recently, especially when trying to solder it

I assume you are talking about C&L's ST baseplates, before investing too much in too much track It will be worthwhile seeing if they are compatible. At one show we sold quite a lot of rail as one society's rail was incompatible with the Exactoscale bases they were selling

As the tool for drawing ages the rail profile enlarges, also the design may differ from the outset. whilst both may they are made to the same code, they will be different. On the other hand they may be compatible
Thanks Hayfield, I have some stainless legacy DCC concepts rail, and enough of their copper clad 1.6mm sleepers to solder the rail straight to. I wanted to do this to get the idea right as these first turnouts and slips are hidden. I then have some c&l plastic baseplates and chairs to try with the legacy rails for the rest of the trackwork.l, but I will switch to c&l rail if I need to. 

I'll try to determine if they are compatible. Perhaps unfortunately, I do have quite abit of the legacy flexitrack already...

Ian 

posted: 6 Nov 2020 08:21

from:

Phil O
 
Plymouth - United Kingdom

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Ian McKee wrote:
Phil, 
Yes, but  unfortunately I can't fix that just now. The loft has no insulation, or ventilation. Summertime temperatures can get unbearably high when it is sunny. We don't get as much sun as other places, but it is s concern. We will need to do some improvements at some point as the roof ridges are old and tiles  probably needing attention.  But the expense is beyond us now.
Ian 

Hi Ian,

Our clubroom has a pitched roof, with no insulation and is quite high, so we put in a false ceiling of Celotex supported by 50 mm x 50 mm timber. The area we had to cover was about 45 ft x 16ft and cost around £1600 with the timber to support it.

This has contained the temperature difference, in the cold winter of a couple of years ago our lowest temperature was 8C and usually stays in double figures and tops out at around 20C and it has cut our heating bill in half, for our two evenings a week.

We are in Torpoint, Cornwall.

Cheers

Phil.

posted: 6 Nov 2020 08:53

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Phil, my fears are increasing! I'll have a think. I take it the temperature differential is the problem, rather that the low or high point? The floor has insulation which reduces heating from below. Making it potentially worse again. 

posted: 6 Nov 2020 13:28

from:

Phil O
 
Plymouth - United Kingdom

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Hi Ian,

Yes it is the temperature difference, all down to the coefficient of expansion. If you lay the track whilst the ambient temperature is low and you leave a small gap for isolation purposes, that will disappear as the temperature rises and in a worse case scenario could lead to buckling as occasionally happens on the real thing. On the other hand if you lay the track with a high ambient temperature, that same gap will increase and lead to possible poor running and possible derailments. Different types of rail have different coefficients, so expand at different rates. I would recommend that you use the same type of rail throughout, ie. All nickel silver, all steel, all stainless or even phosphor bronze, that way it will all move at the same rate.

If I get a chance later, I will have a look at a couple of expansion rates.

Phil.

posted: 6 Nov 2020 13:54

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Thanks for that Phil. 

posted: 6 Nov 2020 14:58

from:

Phil O
 
Plymouth - United Kingdom

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Ok,I have found an online calculator, saves me ageing brain cell from having to do the maths.

All are for a 1 metre length and a 10C temperature increase.

Nickel silver about 0.13mm depending on composition
Steel 0.2mm
S/steel varies according to which grade from 0.16mm to 1.73

Phil

posted: 6 Nov 2020 17:26

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Thanks Phil

posted: 8 Nov 2020 12:42

from:

roythebus
 
Aldington Frith, Ashford, Kent - United Kingdom

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Regarding the expansion problem, many years ago the model Railway club's original layout the Longridge, Brampton Sands and Calshot Railway was built in the early 1960s using the Fleetwood-Shaw track method of wooden sleepers with the rail clipped on every 4 sleepers or so, using code 100. not much else available in those days! The track wasn't pinned down but fixed at every baseboard end.
This work quite well until one day in the late 1970s at Central Hall a BBC film crew came in to film the layout for the day's news. The heat of the extra lighting made the track expand so much that it reached platform level in a short space of time, making it almost impossible to run any trains!

The boards on that layout were about 5'x3' if my memory serves me right.

On the replacement layout "New Annington" PCB sleepers had been "invented" and track was fixed somewhat more securely.

On my home layout with track securely fixed I've had problems with insulation gaps closing up causing electrical problems and that's in a well insulated and heated garden shed. Check this out before you find out the hard way and you have to lift out a lot of track.

posted: 8 Nov 2020 12:57

from:

Ian McKee
 
Argyll And Bute - United Kingdom

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Thanks Roy, I'm looking at insulation. It's going to put everything on hold for awhile. 



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