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topic: 3354Gauges for 0-MF
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posted: 14 Nov 2018 18:09

from:

madscientist
 
 

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Is " Debs " still supplying O-MF gauges and if not has anyone any idea where to get some . Is there a current contact for Debs 
Thanks 
dave



posted: 14 Nov 2018 18:35

from:

Andrew Barrowman
 
USA

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I doubt if Debs will be able to help. The poor lady has been having a really rotten time with medical issues and I believe she is still in hospital.

If you can't find another source I can turn one for you on the lathe. Yours for the postage cost. I'll just need a sketch with dimensions.

Cheers,
Andy
Last edited on 14 Nov 2018 18:36 by Andrew Barrowman
posted: 14 Nov 2018 18:37

from:

madscientist
 
 

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Andrew Barrowman wrote:
I doubt if Debs will be able to help. The poor lady has been having a really rotten time with medical issues and I believe she is still in hospital.

If you can't find another source I can turn one for you on the lathe. Yours for the postage cost. I'll just need a sketch with dimensions.

Cheers,
Andy
Thats extremely kind of you , next step . a drawing, Can anyone  help ?
dave 

posted: 14 Nov 2018 18:52

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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No need for drawing Ahem, how many would you like?

posted: 14 Nov 2018 19:15

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Martin Wynne
 
West Of The Severn - United Kingdom

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According to this recent post, Debs has the 0-MF gauges in stock and is able to supply them:

 http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/137617-actual-track-gauge/page-3#entry3333728

Martin.

posted: 14 Nov 2018 19:22

from:

madscientist
 
 

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Stephen Freeman wrote:
No need for drawing Ahem, how many would you like?
2 please 
thanks 

posted: 14 Nov 2018 19:50

from:

Andrew Barrowman
 
USA

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Martin Wynne wrote:
According to this recent post, Debs has the 0-MF gauges in stock and is able to supply them:

 http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/137617-actual-track-gauge/page-3#entry3333728

Martin.
That's good to hear!

posted: 20 Nov 2018 09:29

from:

madscientist
 
 

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Debs replied to me in detail , no issues getting gauges

posted: 20 Nov 2018 10:20

from:

Bernard Haste
 
 

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Is it possible to obtain gauges to a different gauge to the ones presently on offer?

Bernard

posted: 20 Nov 2018 20:24

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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What gauge do you want?

posted: 20 Nov 2018 20:55

from:

Bernard Haste
 
 

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11.52mm (and a specific rail head width).

Bernard

posted: 21 Nov 2018 18:09

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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Depends on the rail head width. As long as its not too small. Basically anything I can turn on my lathe

posted: 21 Nov 2018 18:14

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Rob Manchester
 
Manchester - United Kingdom

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Stephen Freeman wrote:
Depends on the rail head width. As long as its not too small. Basically anything I can turn on my lathe
Hello Stephen,

As a matter of interest what is the smallest "head" width you are able to produce for roller track gauges ? I use standard parting tools for turning the rail slots but getting blades thin enough for 4mm use is difficult - unless maybe you make your own ?

Rob


posted: 24 Nov 2018 00:32

from:

Andrew Barrowman
 
USA

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Hi Rob,

I grind my own from square HSS stock. It's not difficult. You just need to keep dipping the HSS in water to maintain the hardness. The final step is to polish it down to size with a flat stone or a diamond sharpening plate.

Andy

posted: 24 Nov 2018 23:42

from:

Rob Manchester
 
Manchester - United Kingdom

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Andrew Barrowman wrote:
Hi Rob,

I grind my own from square HSS stock. It's not difficult. You just need to keep dipping the HSS in water to maintain the hardness. The final step is to polish it down to size with a flat stone or a diamond sharpening plate.

Andy
Hi Andy,

Can you explain more ? Are you also turning the stock to make roller gauges or using the square section as the finished gauge ?

Rob


posted: 25 Nov 2018 00:36

from:

Andrew Barrowman
 
USA

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Rob Manchester wrote:
Andrew Barrowman wrote:
Hi Rob,

I grind my own from square HSS stock. It's not difficult. You just need to keep dipping the HSS in water to maintain the hardness. The final step is to polish it down to size with a flat stone or a diamond sharpening plate.

Andy
Hi Andy,

Can you explain more ? Are you also turning the stock to make roller gauges or using the square section as the finished gauge ?

Rob

Hi Rob,

That's how I make a tool from square stock HSS (high-speed steel) to turn the grooves for a track gauge in my lathe. I'll try to post a pic tomorrow. (It's slightly chilly in my workshop at the moment :) )

I was going to make myself a couple of spring loaded gauges that don't care how wide the rail is but I did a body-swerve into 3D printing instead.

Cheers,
Andy

posted: 25 Nov 2018 08:10

from:

Jim Guthrie
 
United Kingdom

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Andy,

You can also get external grooving tools ready made with replaceable bits - not cheap, but ready to go.

http://www.sandvik.coromant.com/en-gb/products/pages/external-grooving-tools.aspx

A supplier like MSC has a wide range of types and suppliers

http://www.mscdirect.co.uk/CGI/INSRCH?ns=1&oldNtt=solid+grooving+tools&oldNtk=Keyword+Search&oldURLVar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scrNtt=solid+external+grooving+tools&image.x=0&image.y=0&Ntk=Keyword+Search

You might find it easier to go to page 467 in their virtual catalogue to see what's there - I can't seem to give URLs into the catalogue.


Jim
Last edited on 25 Nov 2018 08:17 by Jim Guthrie
posted: 25 Nov 2018 12:33

from:

Martin Wynne
 
West Of The Severn - United Kingdom

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Jim Guthrie wrote:
You might find it easier to go to page 467 in their virtual catalogue to see what's there - I can't seem to give URLs into the catalogue.
Hi Jim,

Thanks.

Here's the link to page 483, which has some very thin grooving inserts down to .019" wide, see middle of page:

 http://edition.pagesuite.com/html5/reader/production/default.aspx?pubname=&pubid=9c3eabd2-e3ba-4a9f-8bd3-aa6475bd6e37&pnum=483

(click the pink links to order)

UK heavy-rail widths (2.75") in thou:

4mm/ft: .036"

7mm/ft: .063"

cheers,

Martin.

posted: 25 Nov 2018 19:42

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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Hi,
I use a couple of parting off tools, suitably altered for 7mm and 4mm scale, so can do width for 7mm scale Bullhead and 4mm scale bullhead (approx 1mm). I can probably do smaller if needed.
Rob Manchester wrote:
Stephen Freeman wrote:
Depends on the rail head width. As long as its not too small. Basically anything I can turn on my lathe
Hello Stephen,

As a matter of interest what is the smallest "head" width you are able to produce for roller track gauges ? I use standard parting tools for turning the rail slots but getting blades thin enough for 4mm use is difficult - unless maybe you make your own ?

Rob



posted: 25 Nov 2018 19:55

from:

Andrew Barrowman
 
USA

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Jim Guthrie wrote:
Andy,

You can also get external grooving tools ready made with replaceable bits - not cheap, but ready to go.

http://www.sandvik.coromant.com/en-gb/products/pages/external-grooving-tools.aspx

A supplier like MSC has a wide range of types and suppliers

http://www.mscdirect.co.uk/CGI/INSRCH?ns=1&oldNtt=solid+grooving+tools&oldNtk=Keyword+Search&oldURLVar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scrNtt=solid+external+grooving+tools&image.x=0&image.y=0&Ntk=Keyword+Search

You might find it easier to go to page 467 in their virtual catalogue to see what's there - I can't seem to give URLs into the catalogue.


Jim
Thanks Jim.

They're a bit spendy for me and carbide and I just don't get along. I'm blaming my lathe for not being rigid enough, but it's more likely an operator problem.

This is the sort of thing I was on about.

2983_251454_210000000.jpg2983_251454_210000000.jpg

Cheers,
Andy
Last edited on 25 Nov 2018 19:56 by Andrew Barrowman
posted: 25 Nov 2018 20:09

from:

Bernard Haste
 
 

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Hello Stepen,

Could you make 11.52mm gauge with a rail head width of 32 thou?

Many thanks,

Bernard

posted: 25 Nov 2018 20:14

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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Hi, I will have a look tomorrow as I have a few gauges to make

posted: 25 Nov 2018 20:43

from:

Rob Manchester
 
Manchester - United Kingdom

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Thanks to all for the input on the gauge making. The spring gauge that Andy suggested sound interesting, have to have a think about that option. I guess the gauge face and spring mechanism would both have to sit fairly deeply onto the rail rather than just holding onto the rail head.

I had some P4 gauges a while back ( think they may have been either Exactoscale or possibly K&L ) that were made with an aluminium spacer that slid onto a centre tapped rod. There were various washers that fitted onto the ends, the purpose of which was to apply gauge widening. That design may be worth a thought but you would still need to provide a rail width spacer on each end.

That catalogue could be a serious money-pit. Some nice stuff although I have heard some bad tales of TC tool bits.

Rob


posted: 26 Nov 2018 15:08

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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Hi,
Within tolerance of 0.01mm

Bernard Haste wrote:
Hello Stepen,

Could you make 11.52mm gauge with a rail head width of 32 thou?

Many thanks,

Bernard


posted: 26 Nov 2018 16:41

from:

Bernard Haste
 
 

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Hello Stephen,

Could you send me a private e-mail please?

TRhank you.

Bernard

posted: 26 Nov 2018 19:39

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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Unfortunately you have your email set to private, which means I can't, nor can anybody else.

posted: 26 Nov 2018 19:46

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Martin Wynne
 
West Of The Severn - United Kingdom

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Hi Bernard,

I have changed your email setting for you. Stephen can now see it.

cheers,

Martin.

posted: 26 Nov 2018 21:28

from:

Bernard Haste
 
 

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Thank you,

Would that also explain my not seeing Raymond`s messages?

Bernard

posted: 26 Nov 2018 21:47

from:

Martin Wynne
 
West Of The Severn - United Kingdom

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Bernard Haste wrote:
Thank you,

Would that also explain my not seeing Raymond`s messages?

Bernard
Hi Bernard,

No, emails between you do not have any connection with Templot Club.

The usual reasons for not seeing an email are:

1. it has ended up in your spam/junk folder for some reason, or

2. the sender got your email address wrong, or

3. they added a very large attachment, typically over 10MB.

cheers,

Martin.

posted: 13 Dec 2018 12:31

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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I have just received my latest batch of goodies from PPD despite the best efforts of Royal Mail sending it on a circular tour of the UK.

Upshot is that I now have the lasered blanks for a batch of 3 point gauges for 0MF, more details on availability etc soon.

posted: 13 Dec 2018 13:42

from:

Rob Manchester
 
Manchester - United Kingdom

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Stephen Freeman wrote:
I have just received my latest batch of goodies from PPD despite the best efforts of Royal Mail sending it on a circular tour of the UK.

Upshot is that I now have the lasered blanks for a batch of 3 point gauges for 0MF, more details on availability etc soon.
Yes, please do that. Will be a nice addition to Deb's roller gauges.

Rob


posted: 13 Dec 2018 15:51

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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Next week I hope. I now have to find a use for the "waste" brass, too good to throw and I am sure it will have a use somehow. The brass is 2mm thick, so won't bend and has holes lasered to take the studs to fit on the rail head. Just waiting for the rod for the studs now.
Last edited on 13 Dec 2018 15:55 by Stephen Freeman
posted: 1 Jan 2019 15:17

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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Hi,

I will have to have another go at the CAD as I miscalculated slightly.

However I can still use the blanks for their intended purpose, it's just that I have had to drill some new holes.

I would still have had to drill the holes out anyway as I found that they needed to be 2.1mm in diameter to take 2mm rod. I'll make allowance for that in the amendment.

Anyway I have checked that they work OK, I am just not certain whether or not making them to just fit the rail head so that they can slide along the track is a good thing or a more positive fit is better.

At the moment I have gone for the more positive fit but obviously the studs can be shortened to suit if necessary.

Anyway I have a stock of about 20, which should keep me going for some time.
Last edited on 1 Jan 2019 15:18 by Stephen Freeman
posted: 1 Jan 2019 15:41

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Nigel Brown
 
 

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Me, I'd be tempted to go for the slightly looser fit on the rail. If the chair grips the rail it can be quite difficult to feed the rail through, and I think there's more likelyhood of stresses and damaging the chair.

Nigel

posted: 1 Jan 2019 16:38

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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At the moment I have gone for a sliding fit but not clear of the chairs. Pegs can easily be reduced to clear chairs if desired.
Nigel Brown wrote:
Me, I'd be tempted to go for the slightly looser fit on the rail. If the chair grips the rail it can be quite difficult to feed the rail through, and I think there's more likelyhood of stresses and damaging the chair.

Nigel


posted: 1 Jan 2019 19:32

from:

Rob Manchester
 
Manchester - United Kingdom

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Hi Stephen,

Unless I have got the wrong end of the stick you are making 3 point gauges for O-MF that will give automatic gauge widening. Assuming that to be the case then surely they need to be a snug fit on the rail ? If they are a loose fit the the amount of gauge widening will be different ( and variable ).

What measurements have you used for the distances between the pins along the axis of the rails ? This effects the amount of gauge widening produced for a given radius of curve. In EM for example my EMGS gauges have a longer 'span' than the DCC Concepts ones and therefore give different degrees of widening.

Rob


posted: 1 Jan 2019 21:09

from:

Stephen Freeman
 
Sandbach - United Kingdom

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No slack in the gauge but you don't have to force the issue. The distance between the inside of the short side outer peg and the inside of the long side outer pegs is 43 mm in both cases. The distance between the pegs on the long side is 53mm.

I think that a sliding fit which which does not grip the rail tightly is better because if it is tight it will  tend to make the rail sit up straight, once removed, the cant of the chairs may cause the rails to spring back and be under gauge, which is not what is wanted.

I have attached a photo of one of the gauges. Please note the extra holes are purely there as an aid for assembly with a jig to ensure the gauge is correct.142_070945_580000000.jpg142_070945_580000000.jpg
Last edited on 7 Mar 2019 14:48 by Stephen Freeman


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